a few complaints about desoxi (how am i pumping these comments out so fast i'm so sorry) edit: is super damage 10+(5*acid)? looks like it! if so, JESUS CHRIST. you need 38 stocks of super to deal as much as TERRA's... tldr: desoxi is a very simple, plain character with one really good move, a few other good moves, and several more that lie in the dumps and not much incentive to go for much else to set up her zoning- making a character too strong and too weak at the same time- resulting in them being BORING. and maybe like sf4 dee jay idk
her having no "substance", just kind of one zoning tool that's really strong. it could be fine if you could charge it, or if her alternative tool, D, had a better niche outside of oki setups and being her primary anti-air. something like, i dunno, a setplay tool that forces the opponent to play around it could make her a lot more enjoyable on both sides
C fireball is a very troubling move- really strong, and really boring on both sides. if she gets you to block it, she gets to loop it. it's such a high-hitting projectile that you can't prediction jump it after you block it farther out, so the plan for her just becomes f.A C and if it either hits or block just keep on using C until something bad happens, doesn't help that the CPU doesn't jump so I can't really confirm this by myself. lowering the projectile's effective height would be nice, but jarring considering how TALL this character is.
acid goes NOWHERE as a mechanic. it sounds cool, being an incentive for the opponent to push in and for desoxi to get out, but with just...something about it, it just kinda doesn't do much. i can't exactly put my finger on it, but if i had to guess, it would be that it just doesn't feel that threatening for how it works. it does overall increase her damage, from her not commiting, to her combos, to her zoning patterns, but the fact that it does tick-by-tick damage instead of by frame damage kind of silences its niche? maybe adding recoverable health that desoxi can steal via acid and then getting a hit would work, but i don't know...
the rest of her kit varies between only "DO USE" and "doesn't exist". on the good side... c.A is the universal jab and her fastest option! f.A is a gigantic poke that blockstrings into her best tool! and of course, f.C is a projectile that is incredibly hard to prediction jump from afar, loopable, and forces the opponent to walkblock in a game with no walkblock! c.C is pretty good, too, a grab that instantly gives desoxi another chance at their primary gameplan. and what lies unused... d.A is...a anti air and combo starter/filler, i guess. l.A is pretty good i guess. jump as a whole is so weird... giving a zoner a i-no airdash kind of neutralizes its niche for her- you cant back airdash away for space, and the airdash attack just has...a lot of hitstun despite giving you a hard knockdown, so it kinda doesn't matter. D is a upwards version of C in a game with a 16:9 ratio and emphasis on controlling the horizontal ground, making it go TOO up to really have a good niche somewhere outside of free plus frames during oki. super is a fullscreen love tap that deals 10 damage minimum and 500 maximum based on how much acid you stocked on them. (99 is the max) while it tapping the opponent instantly from far away is nice, its situational damage- often on the low side due to how quickly desoxi can lose acid and how slow gaining acid IS, yeah...you'd rather save it for the ONE BAR dash combos and MOMENTUM STEALERS.
the button scheme seems kinda yikes, thinking about it tldr: jump should've be above l and r and be branded jump, super should've just been on pressing the health bars (like flappy fighter), and taunt is atrocious and should've just been on its own button because like...bro, backdash super.
A, C, and D are fine, but jarring, because jump is B.
you'd think you could just like, put a jump button above the mobile left and right buttons, dub it "j", and go about your day, but the flappy fighter button scheme got to you
the X button is the most...DEVIOUS one out of all of these. flappy fighter at LEAST has you tap the super meter so you can do super, so you could at least put something that says "TAP" to indicate "oh, super" for somebody who...skipped the tutorial for some reason, but apparently not... and then taunt is on DASH PLUS SUPER. DISGUSTING. VILE. EEEEVILLLL. WE COULD'VE PUT THIS ON ITS OWN TAUNT BUTTON. THINK ABOUT ALL THE RUN UP SUPERS THAT THE PLAYERS HAD ATTEMPTED, ONLY TO BE PUNISHED TRYING TO INTIMIDATE Q STREET FIGHTER 3.
for fun; a breakdown of the gargoli blender or at least what i got out of it
first... strike beats backdash/jump throw beats respect block/armor beats dp (terra and cerilla only), mash i would assume you can grab combo breaker since it's a counter- not a burst
know this RPS, it'll let you identify what works and what doesn't
off of any A hit, a delayed cancel of (c.A)AA, D will corner the opponent, thanks to the extra corner carry a delayed tackle gives- albeit you are just short of gaining a bar, unfortunately
to start the blender after, you can do a meaty dash attack to be plus on block after, which due to the size of the absolute behemoth this character is, results in a rather ambiguous mixup of
d.A-c.C or d.A-c.A the first layer!
if you did close a during the first layer, you're left plus one if you don't follow up (it's really easy to hitconfirm in this game, so idk), so you can go into the 2nd layer- ...c.A, c.C or c.A-f.C or c.A, c.A, or c.A-A (delay cancel) a choice between a quick grab, a armored grab, a plus strike, or a frametrap strike... this is getting spooky! your string ends when you do either grab with it either hitting or whiffing, but a c.A stagger keeps you plus, where c.A-A puts you in a pretty bad situation... the 3rd layer- c.A-A~L/R... or c.A-A (nothing) or c.A-A-A (delay cancel into tackle) or c.A-A-f.C you're mostly in trouble here when you do c.A-A. it's -6, so it might be punishable (DEJORGIK YOU COWARD HOW FAST IS TERRA JAB), but you might be able to blow through attempts to punish it with a f.C, or a tackle, depending on how they attempt to punish it- catch fast buttons with a tackle to counter hit them out of it, or if they're trying to go for something flashy, armor through it! if they respect you, DO NOT DO TACKLE WITHOUT METER. -15 with only one option to attempt to subvert the situation- f.C. if you get a dash cancel here, you probably should- you'll be minus, but at least you'll be alive.
other things include... dash attack is normally +0 on block, so starting pressure in neutral starts as fast as that- plus a rps that may or may not be in your favor (DEJORGIK YOU COWARD HOW FAST IS-) depending on who you're playing against and how fast their jab is dash cancel is REALLY good on this character, and pretty much makes super irrelevant outside of like. hitconfirms from hours away or as a desperate way to blow through zoning. you can use it to instill fear in a comical amount of ways- you can retreat just to attempt a armor grab, there's a lot you can do with this as long you're creative and if the opponent is terrified of you!
pre character select port selection would be nice. most fighters have it, and it would let people do keyboard vs gamepad without additional hassles like p2 keyboard controls getting in the way or gamepad being p1 by default so the keyboard has to use numpad but OOPS! your comuter doesn't have umnpad! lmao!
also so i can play port 2 because 2 is greater than 1 :)
as a filthy shoto player, terra is really stupid. she's particularly good at...everything???
she's got a good set for playing neutral, two advancing normals- one leads into a launcher, one is gigantic and lets the characcter play a pseudo zoning game by mixing up fireballs and axes- at the cost of its convertibility, and god DAMN that fireball is SO GOOD. travels quickly and starts quickly, and thanks to dash cancel, it SINGLE HANDEDLY CONTROLS NEUTRAL at the ""cost"" of moving terra forwards. they jump the fireball? anti air with D or dash attack. they block it? your mixup. they get hit...? we'll get to that later! fun fact, fireball can be canceled on frame 19 with dash(?) in a nutshell, terra's dash is 15 frames (known via dashing as the same time as opponent to set frame advantage to 0, then pressing forwards). so subtract 15 from the amount given from a instant fireball dash cancel, which is 34, resulting in 19. i might be dumb, but onto the pressure things!
she also has good pressure on the offensive side!
take this blockstring rq, as a AA C R-A AA...
low punch is +5, so it jails into fireball
fireball's dash cancel leads into a jail into dash attack, and can be staggered to give fireball itself plus frames and turn it into a frametrap- also keeps you outside of the range of other reversals
dash attack ends the string at plus 1
and you can probably turn any of these into a throw, with or without meter
so she has a looping pressure string...alongside impenetrable neutral... surely her defense is poor at the cost of this, ri-
oh. right. shoto. of course she has an invincible reversal. yikes.
and about that on hit thing? what she gets from hitting you is FUCKING MASSIVE. here's a quick combo- usable at any part of the screen! AAAC R-A AA(delay until close to sweep hitbox)A R-A AAD this combo gives terra. 300~ish damage. Puts the opponent in the corner from anywhere. Since it's a D ender, it of course gives you a hard knockdown. You can do a easy fireball meaty directly after this to automatically be plus- unless you're against another Terra, in which it becomes a guessing game of if to or if not to do one based around the invincible reversal. Gives you a ENTIRE BAR OF METER. You could use this to extend the combo, or... Dash cancel to get a taunt stock, or maybe two and still be plus depending on if you're just good at pressing the taunt input.
y-yeah...
so overall, terra has
incredible neutral
strong, looping pressure ala sol f.s
an invincible reversal- a trump card on defense that not many have(?)
and insane reward for hitting the opponent
all for being easily combo broken during combos haha she's so balanced :)
i think i would just... make terra's fireball more gunflame-esque. not make it go at 60mph, launch on hit, maybe a startup increase for a recovery decrease so you can anti-air late jumps (not predicition jumps) and also ABOUT THAT DAMN DASH CANCEL.
make it only available on contact! what, you thought i was going to butcher it? lmao, what do you take me for? a person with wild ideas?
I saw the big post and expected rambling but nah, you cooked with this one. You've clearly done your homework. Thanks for your feedback, i'll keep it in mind.
Is it possible to have a discord server or something for the game because I've got a couple of people to play the game and we've found infinites and tods and overall jank. Here's a lil combo video I made https://youtu.be/efaUrlbzanI?si=-4Q1PwNhYVRVx_ZZ
I watched your video and commented in it. Sure, i'll make a discord server. I need to set some stuff up before but i'm really happy to know there's people interested in this. It's gonna be cool having people to help me find all the jank in this mess. Once i get the server up i'll post an announcement in here.
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a few complaints about desoxi (how am i pumping these comments out so fast i'm so sorry)
edit: is super damage 10+(5*acid)? looks like it! if so, JESUS CHRIST. you need 38 stocks of super to deal as much as TERRA's...
tldr: desoxi is a very simple, plain character with one really good move, a few other good moves, and several more that lie in the dumps and not much incentive to go for much else to set up her zoning- making a character too strong and too weak at the same time- resulting in them being BORING. and maybe like sf4 dee jay idk
her having no "substance", just kind of one zoning tool that's really strong. it could be fine if you could charge it, or if her alternative tool, D, had a better niche outside of oki setups and being her primary anti-air. something like, i dunno, a setplay tool that forces the opponent to play around it could make her a lot more enjoyable on both sides
C fireball is a very troubling move- really strong, and really boring on both sides. if she gets you to block it, she gets to loop it. it's such a high-hitting projectile that you can't prediction jump it after you block it farther out, so the plan for her just becomes f.A C and if it either hits or block just keep on using C until something bad happens, doesn't help that the CPU doesn't jump so I can't really confirm this by myself. lowering the projectile's effective height would be nice, but jarring considering how TALL this character is.
acid goes NOWHERE as a mechanic. it sounds cool, being an incentive for the opponent to push in and for desoxi to get out, but with just...something about it, it just kinda doesn't do much. i can't exactly put my finger on it, but if i had to guess, it would be that it just doesn't feel that threatening for how it works. it does overall increase her damage, from her not commiting, to her combos, to her zoning patterns, but the fact that it does tick-by-tick damage instead of by frame damage kind of silences its niche? maybe adding recoverable health that desoxi can steal via acid and then getting a hit would work, but i don't know...
the rest of her kit varies between only "DO USE" and "doesn't exist".
on the good side...
c.A is the universal jab and her fastest option!
f.A is a gigantic poke that blockstrings into her best tool!
and of course, f.C is a projectile that is incredibly hard to prediction jump from afar, loopable, and forces the opponent to walkblock in a game with no walkblock!
c.C is pretty good, too, a grab that instantly gives desoxi another chance at their primary gameplan.
and what lies unused...
d.A is...a anti air and combo starter/filler, i guess. l.A is pretty good i guess.
jump as a whole is so weird... giving a zoner a i-no airdash kind of neutralizes its niche for her- you cant back airdash away for space, and the airdash attack just has...a lot of hitstun despite giving you a hard knockdown, so it kinda doesn't matter.
D is a upwards version of C in a game with a 16:9 ratio and emphasis on controlling the horizontal ground, making it go TOO up to really have a good niche somewhere outside of free plus frames during oki.
super is a fullscreen love tap that deals 10 damage minimum and 500 maximum based on how much acid you stocked on them. (99 is the max) while it tapping the opponent instantly from far away is nice, its situational damage- often on the low side due to how quickly desoxi can lose acid and how slow gaining acid IS, yeah...you'd rather save it for the ONE BAR dash combos and MOMENTUM STEALERS.
the button scheme seems kinda yikes, thinking about it
tldr: jump should've be above l and r and be branded jump, super should've just been on pressing the health bars (like flappy fighter), and taunt is atrocious and should've just been on its own button because like...bro, backdash super.
A, C, and D are fine, but jarring, because jump is B.
you'd think you could just like, put a jump button above the mobile left and right buttons, dub it "j", and go about your day, but the flappy fighter button scheme got to you
the X button is the most...DEVIOUS one out of all of these. flappy fighter at LEAST has you tap the super meter so you can do super, so you could at least put something that says "TAP" to indicate "oh, super" for somebody who...skipped the tutorial for some reason, but apparently not... and then taunt is on DASH PLUS SUPER. DISGUSTING. VILE. EEEEVILLLL. WE COULD'VE PUT THIS ON ITS OWN TAUNT BUTTON. THINK ABOUT ALL THE RUN UP SUPERS THAT THE PLAYERS HAD ATTEMPTED, ONLY TO BE PUNISHED TRYING TO INTIMIDATE Q STREET FIGHTER 3.
for fun; a breakdown of the gargoli blender or at least what i got out of it
first...
strike beats backdash/jump
throw beats respect
block/armor beats dp (terra and cerilla only), mash
i would assume you can grab combo breaker since it's a counter- not a burst
know this RPS, it'll let you identify what works and what doesn't
off of any A hit, a delayed cancel of (c.A)AA, D will corner the opponent, thanks to the extra corner carry a delayed tackle gives- albeit you are just short of gaining a bar, unfortunately
to start the blender after, you can do a meaty dash attack to be plus on block after, which due to the size of the absolute behemoth this character is, results in a rather ambiguous mixup of
d.A-c.C or d.A-c.A
the first layer!
if you did close a during the first layer, you're left plus one if you don't follow up (it's really easy to hitconfirm in this game, so idk), so you can go into the 2nd layer-
...c.A, c.C or c.A-f.C or c.A, c.A, or c.A-A (delay cancel)
a choice between a quick grab, a armored grab, a plus strike, or a frametrap strike... this is getting spooky! your string ends when you do either grab with it either hitting or whiffing, but a c.A stagger keeps you plus, where c.A-A puts you in a pretty bad situation...
the 3rd layer-
c.A-A~L/R... or c.A-A (nothing) or c.A-A-A (delay cancel into tackle) or c.A-A-f.C
you're mostly in trouble here when you do c.A-A. it's -6, so it might be punishable (DEJORGIK YOU COWARD HOW FAST IS TERRA JAB), but you might be able to blow through attempts to punish it with a f.C, or a tackle, depending on how they attempt to punish it- catch fast buttons with a tackle to counter hit them out of it, or if they're trying to go for something flashy, armor through it! if they respect you, DO NOT DO TACKLE WITHOUT METER. -15 with only one option to attempt to subvert the situation- f.C. if you get a dash cancel here, you probably should- you'll be minus, but at least you'll be alive.
other things include...
dash attack is normally +0 on block, so starting pressure in neutral starts as fast as that- plus a rps that may or may not be in your favor (DEJORGIK YOU COWARD HOW FAST IS-) depending on who you're playing against and how fast their jab is
dash cancel is REALLY good on this character, and pretty much makes super irrelevant outside of like. hitconfirms from hours away or as a desperate way to blow through zoning. you can use it to instill fear in a comical amount of ways- you can retreat just to attempt a armor grab, there's a lot you can do with this as long you're creative and if the opponent is terrified of you!
pre character select port selection would be nice. most fighters have it, and it would let people do keyboard vs gamepad without additional hassles like p2 keyboard controls getting in the way or gamepad being p1 by default so the keyboard has to use numpad but OOPS! your comuter doesn't have umnpad! lmao!
also so i can play port 2 because 2 is greater than 1 :)
as a filthy shoto player, terra is really stupid. she's particularly good at...everything???
she's got a good set for playing neutral, two advancing normals- one leads into a launcher, one is gigantic and lets the characcter play a pseudo zoning game by mixing up fireballs and axes- at the cost of its convertibility, and god DAMN that fireball is SO GOOD. travels quickly and starts quickly, and thanks to dash cancel, it SINGLE HANDEDLY CONTROLS NEUTRAL at the ""cost"" of moving terra forwards. they jump the fireball? anti air with D or dash attack. they block it? your mixup. they get hit...?
we'll get to that later! fun fact, fireball can be canceled on frame 19 with dash(?)
in a nutshell, terra's dash is 15 frames (known via dashing as the same time as opponent to set frame advantage to 0, then pressing forwards). so subtract 15 from the amount given from a instant fireball dash cancel, which is 34, resulting in 19.
i might be dumb, but onto the pressure things!
she also has good pressure on the offensive side!
take this blockstring rq, as a
AA C R-A AA...
low punch is +5, so it jails into fireball
fireball's dash cancel leads into a jail into dash attack, and can be staggered to give fireball itself plus frames and turn it into a frametrap- also keeps you outside of the range of other reversals
dash attack ends the string at plus 1
and you can probably turn any of these into a throw, with or without meter
so she has a looping pressure string...alongside impenetrable neutral... surely her defense is poor at the cost of this, ri-
oh. right. shoto. of course she has an invincible reversal. yikes.
and about that on hit thing? what she gets from hitting you is FUCKING MASSIVE.
here's a quick combo- usable at any part of the screen!
AAAC R-A AA(delay until close to sweep hitbox)A R-A AAD
this combo gives terra.
300~ish damage.
Puts the opponent in the corner from anywhere.
Since it's a D ender, it of course gives you a hard knockdown. You can do a easy fireball meaty directly after this to automatically be plus- unless you're against another Terra, in which it becomes a guessing game of if to or if not to do one based around the invincible reversal.
Gives you a ENTIRE BAR OF METER. You could use this to extend the combo, or...
Dash cancel to get a taunt stock, or maybe two and still be plus depending on if you're just good at pressing the taunt input.
y-yeah...
so overall, terra has
incredible neutral
strong, looping pressure ala sol f.s
an invincible reversal- a trump card on defense that not many have(?)
and insane reward for hitting the opponent
all for being easily combo broken during combos haha she's so balanced :)
i think i would just... make terra's fireball more gunflame-esque. not make it go at 60mph, launch on hit, maybe a startup increase for a recovery decrease so you can anti-air late jumps (not predicition jumps) and also ABOUT THAT DAMN DASH CANCEL.
make it only available on contact! what, you thought i was going to butcher it? lmao, what do you take me for? a person with wild ideas?
weh.... this game good. can't wait to zone people
also when actual button configuration i NEED to lab out situations by manually playing as both players because i like pretending to be desk.
I saw the big post and expected rambling but nah, you cooked with this one. You've clearly done your homework. Thanks for your feedback, i'll keep it in mind.
Is it possible to have a discord server or something for the game because I've got a couple of people to play the game and we've found infinites and tods and overall jank. Here's a lil combo video I made https://youtu.be/efaUrlbzanI?si=-4Q1PwNhYVRVx_ZZ
Hey 👋
I watched your video and commented in it. Sure, i'll make a discord server. I need to set some stuff up before but i'm really happy to know there's people interested in this. It's gonna be cool having people to help me find all the jank in this mess. Once i get the server up i'll post an announcement in here.